update/better documentation (Paid)

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by Johxz » Mon Jan 04, 2016 3:07 am

someone can help with new tutorials? update and do better documentation? this job is paid.

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by Duion » Mon Jan 04, 2016 3:46 am
Tutorials for what?
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by JeffR » Mon Jan 04, 2016 3:53 pm
Anything in particular you'd like to see updated?

Little easier for someone to get started if there's some highlights you feel should get attention first. "Documentation and Tutorials" is a pretty big target area ;)
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by Duion » Mon Jan 04, 2016 7:06 pm
"How to make an MMO"
Dwarf King
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by Dwarf King » Mon Jan 04, 2016 8:42 pm
What is wrong with the current tutorials(GG fps tutorial) and Steve Acaster's resources/tutorials for fps and tactical games?

Both are on the GG site but as I understood it, that site will not go away. We could link to them.

Those guides I found really good and they thought me a bunch about the engines capabilities and its flexibility. Sure some of them are a little out of date but not much.

Here let me link them here for the OP. They are really good:

Steve Acaster's gems

GG's Official FPS/Beginner Torque 3D tutorial

GG's Guides

Gem-A-Day-Paul Dana(more target for Torque Game Engine all in all)

I often hear people talking about the lack of guides and tutorials. That is not true. The GG site has a huge amount of them. Steve Acaster has also made a lot.

Beside that the Torque 3D Cookbook David Wyand is also a real gem one must have. If you search the huge GG database you will also find many gems and solutions.

Is it some special tutorials that you find to be out of date?

Happy New Year!

@ Duion
How helpful and informative... :roll:
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by Johxz » Tue Jan 05, 2016 1:32 am
First sorry for my answer, I don't have intention to offend anyone.

@ Duion oh come on! really??? "How to make a MMO"? what's wrong with you? why the sarcasm? some people don't want to just copy and paste the entire engine and published in store steam :roll: :roll: :roll: sorry but someone has to say it.

@ Dwarf King as you can see the last posts about tutorials/books, I was collaborating so I know the existence of all this documentation/books/tutorials/pages... :? :?

so what are you saying is do all this and that's it?? right? :lol: :lol: and why are you only talking about FPS tutorials?? :?

A lot of this are outdated and anybody don't know if still work even the SC don't know I read some "SC/other people" answered where they recommend a tutorials/guide and then a error/problem and then they answered was "oh! that is deprecated" :| :| seriously?? and the newbie need to struggle even days for realise that was a deprecated.

update the documentation, documented the new features, do more tutorials have all of this revised and organized. But I suppose the same old lurker will be the same using torque3d in the future... if we not change that.

Anybody was using some other engine? you all sure read the tutorial/documentation section, so what's the difference with torque 3D documentation? :|

@ JeffR Hi, yes I know sorry about that, is wide open, but is a bit true, let me explain. This is for the community. Like dwarf said a lot of people said about the lack of guides and tutorials, why people said that? I know it because I read that sometimes reddit/garagegames/IRC/other games develop pages/other game engine pages. I know is not lack but is very disorganized and outdated.

This engine is more for programmers that artist, some of tutorials/documentation is with code.... but dawrf what is not said is a lot of this tutorials have "code" attached and you can't download from gg or any site, code writing by someone in a rush and only god know what that creature want to do hahaha, old videos removed, incomplete guides (part 1 to 5 but only 1 exist), post/tutorials/guides removed by someone went crazy and erase everything, images removed or broken, broken code, the post have pages of different people through the ages updating the code in a very disorganized manner and then it don't work :lol: or you need to download some other file from other post to complete this but that post was erase, very very old tutorials post that can work but with a lot of work and you need to know the engine C++/TS to update that.

This job is for do a clean quality documentation/tutorials/HOW-TO section. Old documentation will be revised, updated, with new tutorial/guides or how-to. The jobs It will be phased or milestone and the pay always it will be at the end. The person who help, need to published in the wiki, then be reviewed and approved, then it will pay. The SC and the community will be involve to improve or give advice.

So how about if the newcomer want to do: (how they begin with?)
1) A car game or add a car in they game.
2) A board game
3) Or they want to do a mirror
4) Or a radar
5) Or a camera, where you can use different "security cameras"
6) Some game effect (the common ones) like fire, etc...
7) How about if the newcomer want to do a FPS but instead of pistol they want to use magic, like ice ball, fire or something.
9) If the game is a space ship? how they can add a model and how they can change the soldier model for the ship?
10) How about if the newcomer want to do a 2D or 2.5D game and they want to use Torque3D?
11) A horizontal menu where you can select items (The common ones)
12) Or they want to place objects in the game to build stuff (Very popular this days) (I'm not talking voxel, just to place different object). How they begin? or at least some basic of placing cubes one above the other.

Just a ideas from people that sometimes I read on posts.

Dwarf King
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by Dwarf King » Tue Jan 05, 2016 3:11 am

and why are you only talking about FPS tutorials?? :?
I am not ;) Steve Acaster's resources has a very good prototype of a tactical turn based game. It is even possible to download it(as far as I know). Hence I call his resources for gems :D But I have noticed that some of the pictures has blanked out in his tutorials/resources( @ Steve_Yorkshire ). However, the fps tutorial is a must for any newcomer to go through. Crawl before you walk.

Regarding outdated and deprecated code then when I used Unreal 4 that engine also saw outdated tutorials very fast as the engine got constantly updated. I did a C++ book on Unreal to get the hang of the workflow(UE4 C++ API) and the book used deprecated C++ code and I was using a later version of the engine. I did some forum search and solve it. This part is no longer correct: edit - UE4 correct their Youtube videos with squared text boxes to correct wrong statements as that engine sees new versions. - edit - UE4 updates their tutorials with new videosfor new engine versions now and then and as such they no longer use boxes in the videos.

The biggest difference with "bigger engines", in my opinion built upon use/testing of them, are their huge amount of video tutorials. Tutorials about inventory GUI, combat systems etc. That Torque 3D users can find scattered all over the GG site and then get ideas from that and build upon it. T3D has some Vimeo tutorial videos for using editors. They are fine. The guide and the fps are easy for newcomers to find on GG's site.

HeroEngine had A LOT of outdated stuff. UE4 evolved too fast and books(few of those due to the fast development) and videos could not follow up(so squared text boxes are used). It is very costly to keep the documentation up to date.

No matter how many tutorials we put up then people using an engine will have to learn to think as a coder/programmer and know how to learn an API. That counts in UE4, Unity and T3D. Not even with Blueprint in UE4 can you run away from learning an API(the Blueprint API :D ) and see some functions you used to use end up being deprecated over time.

On the Unreal forums you can read people ending up being disappointed about that they hit a brick wall when they realize that Blueprint is coding and that they need to think like a programmer/scripter in order to make everything play together. I also read a thread over their about a person's project being broken as he updated due to deprecated Blueprint/C++ code.

Just to put it blunt. I think your idea is good :mrgreen: I just wanted to make a point here that all engines see this problem over time as they evolve. It is a common problem. If the code/scripts documentation were hook up against the engine it would be more easy(hardly gonna happen).

I suggest that you keep a list of deprecated stuff on this forum, so when/if you remove something in a new version then people can go and see what has been deprecated... Perhaps you already do that(github wise ;) ) or people might just use an Beyond Compare like me to see what has changed before updating/porting?

So I agree better tutorials that are up to date can never hurt. Sadly I have both my hands and my feet locked into work for now.

Edit: Typos etc.
Last edited by Dwarf King on Thu Jan 21, 2016 1:39 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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by Steve_Yorkshire » Tue Jan 05, 2016 3:39 am
But I have noticed that some of the pictures has blanked out in his tutorials/resources
Some of the old free upload/hosts seem to have bugged/deleted some of my old pics - which is annoying but hey, get what you pay for. :/

Just to note, all my old tutorials should be good with teh exception that $typemasks::TsStatic (or whatever it was called) no longer exists and needs updating to $TypeMasks::StaticObjectType - but apart from that, should work as written.

So ... How To Into MMO not getting much traction, then? ;) :P :mrgreen:
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by Johxz » Tue Jan 05, 2016 5:42 am
Thanks @ Dwarf King I don't know that about UE4. I don't have time too because of my job. Well I try to help insofar as it can to the community, may be paying to someone that have more time :) really this is a good engine and I don't want to people leave. You right about github :!:
which is annoying but hey, get what you pay for. :/
:shock: Ahmmm.... it is free does not mean doing a bad job.... even if you pays does not ensure that someone do a good job. So, the statement is not valid. ;)
So ... How To Into MMO not getting much traction, then?
:lol: :lol: sorry about that...

Thanks for the comments guys... Well hope I can help... I don't have time but this is I can help and give back to the community.
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by LukasPJ » Tue Jan 05, 2016 8:44 am
Thanks for the initiative Johxz and I think it's a great initiative, did you consider asking for specific documentation though? So you can set up a "do this, get this" system. You could use the bounty system (look at the bottom of the page)!

Also, it'd be great if any new tutorials were added to the wiki!
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